Most recently, McCoy joined with some of the world’s finest guitarists — John Scofield, Derek Trucks, Marc Ribot, Bill Frisell, and the album’s lone banjoist, Bela Fleck — to record Guitars. Supported by Jack DeJohnette on drums and Ron Carter on bass, McCoy dances with each six-string star, reinventing classic tunes like “Greensleeves,” “My Favorite Things,” “500 Miles,” and his own rollicking “Passion Dance.”
We recently caught up with McCoy to discuss Guitars and guts, composing and experimentation.
Who’s idea was it to play duets with such a range of talented guitarists?Carlos Santana and I have known each other for years, and I wrote a song for Carlos when we worked together. I remember when I was with John Coltrane, we recorded with guitarists as well, so I thought it was time for me to do something like that again. I’ve been using horns and such for so many years, so why not try using guitar more often?
Did you have to adjust your style at all to work with your guitarists?It’s a funny thing, because piano is a string instrument too, and I found there’s a connection there soundwise. It was easy to create the marriage between the instruments because of their nature. There’s some really nice compatibility.
Were any of your voicings different — less dense, perhaps — to make space for the guitarists?It all depended on who it was. In order to make the marriage work, we did have to make minor adjustments. We listened to each other and played more sparsely, as opposed to laying down heavy harmonic things, so we wouldn’t conflict with each other. We had to be very conscious of what we were both doing, because you can’t do the same thing at the same time.
How did you approach playing with such a diverse range of collaborators? Some tracks are very straight-ahead and clean, but Marc Ribot’s playing is definitely grungier.Conceptually, Marc was more “out.” I had to be conscious of that as well. If he wants to go out, I have to go with him! He’d also listen to me very well, and he could match what I was playing. That’s one thing I like about him.
You’ve been playing some of the songs on Guitars for years — “Passion Dance,” “Mr. P.C.,” and “My Favorite Things,” for example. How do you keep those songs fresh each time you play them?You must realize every day is different. We don’t want to compare today with yesterday, even though there might be some things you do that could be similar. But it’s never the exact same thing. I may have developed that concept because I play the type of improvisational music I play. I try to enjoy the moment and see what today has to offer. This music exposes that sort of thing, taking a moment and seeing what you can do with it.
When you sit down to play “Passion Dance” or “My Favorite Things,” are you literally thinking about something that makes you passionate, or some of your own favorite things, and trying to play what you’re feeling through your fingers?Consciously thinking about what you’re doing can stymie your creative energy. When you take that time to think about what to play in a given moment, the moment’s gone by. You have to do something at that instant. Maybe if you hear some sounds similar to something you did before, maybe you do it, but you do it differently than you did last time.
When I played “My Favorite Things,” when I recorded it without John, I didn’t want it to sound exactly like it did the first time. But then again, I threw in some things that were reminiscent of the original, things that I really liked that I did with him, even though I didn’t want it to sound like I was trying to copy what I had already done. It was nice reminiscing about recording with John when I was recording Guitars. That was a great song. John really liked it and I think we all played great on the original recording.
So when you’re sitting down and soloing, you’re thinking about nothing but the music and the moment.Yes, you don’t have time to figure out anything because the moment is of the essence. You have to keep your mind and heart open, go for it, and see what you come up with. It’s good because it leaves room for exploration.
Considering the level of mastery you have at the piano, do you ever sit down and think, “I’m going to come up with five new voicings for a halfdiminished chord”?Absolutely not. You see, when you think about things too much, it slows your growth. If you think about this chord here, what it is, how to play it, it can get in the way. If, over the years, you have experimented with various voicings and things, you use them as building blocks and you build on those sounds. You don’t have to disregard anything and say, “Well I played that years ago. I can’t use it!” You expand on what you’ve done, and you don’t have to be conscious of it. If you’re like, “Oh my god, I’m gonna play this C with this F#, and if I add the B with it in another register, it’ll create a very wide space,” it’ll get in your way. You have to just play it. You’ve probably played that voicing before, or something like it, and it was in your mind. You can’t be conscious of it because you miss the moment.
So is practicing the time for conscious thought?I don’t actually practice that much. I compose. When I have a session coming up, I usually like to write new songs. Unless I’m making a conscious effort to do a record of standards, I prepare by creating new material. This is improvised music. You put creativity and spontaneity into it. For me, composing is like playing — you’re just slowing it down and putting different things together.
Really, composition is the same as improvisation, except you write it down and piece it all together. Sometimes it comes quickly, but sometimes it takes time.
For players who are trying to get to that point where they can completely let go at the piano and play what they feel, is it more important to just get up there, do it and make mistakes, or to sit down and really study?Make mistakes and learn! Be adventurous! That’s important. If you play something and you’re not happy with it, you’re going to add this or subtract that. And that’s good. If you plan everything, the moments go by and you miss out. If you jump in and try it a lot, you’ll get good at taking chances. It’s a creative risk, but you get used to it. That’s how you come up with new things and discover yourself.
It sounds like you have to have supreme confidence in yourself to pull that off.That’s how you do it. You develop your confidence by taking those plunges. If you don’t do it, you don’t develop confidence in yourself and you’re afraid. It’s all about fear. Don’t be afraid to take the plunge!
It’s like when you learn how to swim as a kid. Sometimes the parents throw kids in the water, or demonstrate what they should do to propel themselves. They’ll put them in the water, and before you know it, the kid will understand what swimming is all about. That’s a lesson in life. Don’t be afraid to learn how to propel yourself and take chances.
How did you get over your own fear?First of all, the people I played with helped. Working with John was great for me. At some point, he really began to delve into an area where I had to just follow him. He became atonal. He started moving to new places and he would play phrases where I had to put some harmonic thing underneath, so it sounded like we were moving together, but at the same time, free. It was good for me.
Can you remember any times when you’ve taken a risk, tried to play something different, and hated it?No, when you start thinking about it, you realize that there’s validity in whatever you play. There are no mistakes. If you’re listening to the musicians you’re playing with, if you want to be compatible, and if you’re trying to come up with something together — that’s the purpose of playing and creating harmony with other people. Especially in this art form, it’s like being a painter. He has a little slab of paint, throws it on the canvas, and thinks, “Oh my god, look at that color!” He keeps adding to it and, before he knows it, he has this whole thing going on. He took a chance and made art.
You can apply that lesson everywhere. You can’t be afraid to take chances. If you don’t take risks, you may never have a happy life!
The Real McCoy
Webpage: www.mccoytyner.com
Born: December 11, 1938 in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
Age when he started playing with John Coltrane: 17.
Early landmark jazz albums he played on: John Coltrane, My Favorite Things; Benny Golson and Art Farmer, Meet the Jazztet.
Other major Coltrane albums he’s played on: Live at the Village Vanguard, Impressions, and A Love Supreme.
Number of Grammy Awards won: Four.
Motivation to finish your album you’ve been working on for years: McCoy has released nearly 80 albums under his own name. What’s your excuse?
A Selected McCoy Tyner Discography
With John Coltrane
My Favorite Things (Atlantic) Live at the Village Vanguard (Impulse!) A Love Supreme (Impulse!)
As a solo artist
Inception (Impulse!) The Real McCoy (Blue Note) Sahara (Milestone/OJC) Trident (Milestone/OJC) Dimensions (Elektra) New York Reunion (Chesky) Afro Blue (Telarc) Guitars (Half Note/McCoy Tyner)
JAZZ AND DANCE
McCoy Tyner has a penchant for choosing unique and talented collaborators, amongst them master tap dancer Savion Glover, the man behind the Broadway show Bring in ’da Noise, Bring in ’da Funk. Their performances are striking — with McCoy seated at the piano and Savion tapping on the floor nearby, the two jam, creating a unique and expressive interplay.
“Tap and jazz work well together historically,” says McCoy. “Savion loves the music. He drums so well with his feet, and his rhythmic feel is excellent. He listens to everything. If I play a phrase that’s riveting, he’s right on top of it. He’s very attentive and is very gifted.”
McCoy has a background in dance himself. “Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire — back in the day I saw their movies and I really enjoyed them,” he says. “I had a wonderful childhood in terms of the variety of musical situations I was in. One of my teachers in junior high school, her friend owned the dance school. They said they needed some male dancers — I’m a musician! But I was glad I went. It was really nice. I did African dancing and some ballet, actually. There’s a lot of great music associated with it.”
Would McCoy ever consider switching things up with Savion on the piano and himself dancing up a storm? “Hey, that’d be a great show!” he says, laughing. “We’ll have to relish that!”